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Underplanting roses
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Posted by
femmeradsy Newcastle NSW (
My Page) on
Mon, Aug 15, 05 at 3:47
| Hi all. I'm new to this forum, and keen to hear your ideas. Now I know that a lot of people are against underplanting their roses, but after several years of a plain bed with nothing but mulch at my roses' feet, I have decided that I do want to plant something under there. The bed is 5x3m, with 2 rows of 5 hybrid teas, and I've already planted miniature box around the edge of the rectangle. Now what to use to fill in the middle? I'll probably only use one kind of plant, as I like things in solid blocks since they look good and are much easier to care for - but I could be talked into something different. What would you use? Thanks! |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Well, don't plant violets - they're a haven for spider mite and darned hard to get rid of when they take over. You don't want to plant anything that'll damage the roots of the roses or you'll get suckers. We've planted alstroemarias (the low growing variety) and they seem to be okay. Nepeta is the one thats commonly grown, but it does need chopping back. Campanula (low growing varieties) seem okay. If you're growing really tall roses you could consider taller perennials, but they all make it more difficult at pruning time. Von. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by Snodge Outer Sydney (My Page) on
Mon, Aug 15, 05 at 5:32
Nepeta is good, because it dies back at the time you want to feed and mulch, then grows back over providing shade for the ground. Various salvias also good for same reason. There's a range of nifty underplantings that have this habit. I like blue things under roses....is it scutelaria I'm thinking of? Nice deep blue. Creates a nice contrast.
Or daylilies work quite well for me, and you could choose dormant ones if you like. I don't particularly like stuff that forms a permanent carpet, though Chocolate mint isn't too bad, I just feed and mulch over the top and it comes up through. Keeps it getting out of hand...that and not too much water :o) |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Bulbs are okay too...I have patches of bulbs planted here and there and they make a nice splash of colour when the roses have been pruned. Iphieons colonise well amongst the old roses and pop up through the mulch regardless of how thick its been laid & can make a neat edging as well. We planted medium-height bearded iris around the edge of a section of our rose garden, they're okay as long as they don't get too close to the base of the rose. The iris don't like mulch. Muscari are pretty when the roses are dormant, and the species gladiolus look great in patches here and there too. Various daffodils - we've planted mainly pink & jonquils are something else to look forward to. Von. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Hi Deb I recently followed a link on the Rose Gallery forum where people have posted photos of their companion plantings. Most are USA-based but viewing them is a nice experience even if you don't get any ideas you can use. Have fun Jackie |
Here is a link that might be useful: Rose Gallery Forum
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by varmi WA Aust (My Page) on
Tue, Aug 16, 05 at 12:10
| My favourite is the very common allysum "Sweet Alice"....terrific little plant. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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Clearly, if you have planted a box hedge around the border of the garden, then you will want plants that show ABOVE the hedge. I presume you intend to keep the hedge fairly low?
You might consider some tall flowering plants such as liliums, bearded or siberian irises, windflowers, or even a tall growing annual. Anything along these lines will give you only a seasonal flowering. My personal choice would be a mixed planting, so that I had a variety of blooms at different times, but a single mass of colour for a short period would be spectacular.
Under my Just Joey roses (8 standards in a bed 1m wide) I have planted Iris unguicularis (winter iris) and Sprekelia (jacobean lily) on one side, and bearded iris and daylilies on the other side. I decided against a hedge, as the I. unguicularis are not tall enough to be seen. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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I too like mass plantings, and just adore blue flowers under roses as blue goes with all other colours.
I grow the long flowering blue geranium (not pelargonium), called Criss Canning. I grow it underneath standard roses and, in another part of the garden, behind a box hedge. It flowers from November to May, dying down just when you want to prune and attend to the roses. It is very pretty and delicate looking and grows to about 40-50cm high. It will grow in full sun so long as it is well mulched which would be the case with roses anyway. It is usually available by mail order from Lambley nursery or Tesselaars. I really can't recommend this plant enough. People often knock on the door to ask what it is and, now that I've been dividing it for some years, I usually have a few potted plants on hand to give away. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Thanks for all these ideas! This is a great forum. I find myself wanting to plant them all ... as usual ... What got me thinking about all this was a visit to the Hunter Valley Gardens on the weekend to see their Floraide displays. I was stunned at what they had below their standard roses: Star Jasmine! Yes, the vigorous climber. I have to say that it looked absolutely brilliant, but the staff did warn me that I requires regular cutting back. I think I will stick to something simpler ... |
Here is a link that might be useful: Floriade at Hunter Valley Gardens
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by plaur Z9 NSW AUST (My Page) on
Wed, Aug 17, 05 at 9:06
I live in your area and have found perennial nemesia in dusky pink,lavender and purple are good clumpers which flower all seasons and are tough.Don't buy the Strawberries and Cream,its a vigorous spreader!The smaller clumping salvia farinaecous(sp)flowers well all year.Larkspur can look pretty just for spring and early summer and I always have dianthus in my garden.
Pam. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by varmi WA Aust (My Page) on
Wed, Aug 17, 05 at 21:46
| Wattleblossom, the geranium you mention "Cris Canning" sounds interesting. Is there a pic I can view on the internet? I tried to search for it and got nothing. I agree, blue is magnificent under roses. Thanks for the tip whoever said violets are pest magnets, good to know. I do love them though :)
Varmi |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Varmi, Lambley Nursery in Victoria list Criss Canning in their current on-line catalogue, and there is a photograph. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Don't plant Evening Primrose. :-( |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| why not? I have just planted some evening primrose in a large new bed under 5 marie van houttes and 5 crabapple ionesis (and a Mrs BR Cant and a Nevada and a Gloire Lyonnaise and a Penelope). I need something rampant to cover the bed (even though it is mulched) until and after marie gets going which may take a year or 2. I was told evening primrose is rampant (this new bed with just the sticks of bare rooted roses and the new crabapples is 30m x 2m) and so I thought; 'good'. Am I wrong? |
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by Snodge Outer Sydney (My Page) on
Fri, Aug 19, 05 at 15:37
| No, not wrong at all. Rampant suits some situations better than others that's all. The evening primrose will do what you want, seeds readily and is tough as. A whole bed under the roses sounds lovely indeed. It will however outcompete other plants not so enthusiastic about life, so don't try to mix anything a bit less vigorous or fussy with them unless you want to be defending their right to sun pretty regularly....and I'd probably err on the side of caution and not plant it too near any boundaries with bushland. No need to water it that's for sure, they laugh with gay abandon at the hottest summer days, they just sit there looking lovely. You can just make sure the roses are OK and the evening primrose will look after itself. Personally I like them, but they don't get much of a run here to take over (not enough surface water)...I've got both the pink and the white one. I think the pink is prettier by a long way. Phylla nodiflora (?) is one that will romp around all over the place- at my place far worse than the evening primrose. I'm thinking of eradicating it. I planted some and then noticed a "rampant" warning on a posting, and waited to see. Have to say I agree. Better at smothering even than the primrose, and it climbs over stuff to do it. A bit irritating actually. On the other hand it does shade the earth effectively. The phylla's not as dense as say, erigeron, another worth keeping an eye on, and I suppose you can just pull it off stuff. I've got some dianthus and daylilies around the edge of the bed and the phylla does't seem to resent being made to live around those spots. You've got to keep an eye on it though. The unforgivable part as far as I'm concerned is climbing up and through the roses themselves, over the graft and areas where you're wanting new basal growth to emerge, and this of course isn't the easiest area to get in and maintain. I'm expecting the offending bed will go. Can't say I'm too sorry. I'll stick with the catmint, and other herbs and salvias I think. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by deejaus Melb.Vic. Aust (My Page) on
Fri, Aug 19, 05 at 21:13
I have violets growing under some roses and have never had any problems with that combination. Perhaps it depends on the area you are in.
Cheers,
Dee. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Dee, I lost points for having violets growing under roses when my garden was judged by rosarians in a competition. It was they who told me about the dangers...and then when we came to get rid of them, it was a MAMMOTH task! We still find the odd violet popping up, and its at least 10 years since we took them out. S.A. is probably drier than Melbourne, but I think where we live we're more or less on a par. Von. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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Von,
You certainly have my curiosity aroused! Were yours just the ordinary purple violets (viola odorata) or were they a more modern cultivar?
Cheers,
Dee. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by Snodge Outer Sydney (My Page) on
Sun, Aug 21, 05 at 0:30
| If violets are a problem that could put paid to my moving Crepescule (or planting a replacement) over in the bed that is full of established violets! That could cramp my style somewhat! So long for any fantasies of having Crepescule the rose and Crepescule the violet anywhere near eachother! LOL. Oh well, I guess it would have been more likely to keep my beautiful big purple one anyway. Crepescule the violet hasn't proved the easiest thing to aquire. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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Violets are a major weed problem in my acidic soil, even worse than Sorrel. I had one small plant, which I left to bloom when I first moved here, because I liked the flowers. It shot seed everywhere.
The other plant I find a problem is the seed from hybrid pansies, which goes backward in flower quality, and ends up several generations on as a small, prolifically weedy plant. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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| Dee & Snodge, I don't think I'd trust any sort of violet. Its a long time ago since I planted mine, so trying to remember the actual name is a tough ask... but there was one named after royalty, a pink violet, a white violet and a *sweet* violet - now that could be anything! I had visions of a carpet of sweet smelling violets back in those days. We have slightly acidic soil too, Jan. Von. |
RE: Underplanting roses
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- Posted by Snodge Outer Sydney (My Page) on
Sun, Aug 21, 05 at 5:24
| Yeah, violets are certainly tough little beggars! I have experience that they're not good neighbours to other smallish plants. Not even the very vigorous grass weeds can make headway where the violet has it's power base. I have two types of violet very much established in the ground, a large purple (named variety but name escapes me) and a pink one. I have to say the purple one is very fragrant, with large flowers and long stems for picking and does form a large fragrant carpet. Exceedingly drought tolerant, it can be so dry it's all wilted, but it will hang out unwatered until some rain falls and come good. Flowering like crazy at the moment and looking very lovely. The pink is a disappointment because the flowers aren't taller than the leaves, but it's almost as vigorous as the purple. Bit pointless! Where my violets are is an isolated bed along the driveway, a tough spot where not much else is happy, and where until recently there was massive competition with a very large melaleuca on the other side of the fence (they're building and ripped it out to fit the scaffolding in). The daphne loves it over there though, and one day I'm considering having a daphne hedge...I just have to pull my finger out and propagate from the bush 'cause gee they're expensive to buy, though perhaps if I just slip one in the trolley now and again? Magnificent weeding downwind from this garden at the moment, with both smellies in flower. I wouldn't put the violets in the general rose garden, but I'm happy with them where they are. I guess I should plant out the apricot flowered violet I've been trying to kill in a pot.....where I've just ripped out the erigeron......just along from the violets...now that would be an interesting head to head duel violets v erigeron :o) |
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