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What do you do for grass?
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Posted by jxa44 (My Page) on Sun, Jan 16, 05 at 10:53
| I'm planting an allee of italian cypress and would like to put grass (or grass like plants) at their feet.
I live in an area that frequently freezes in the winter. We get tons of rain (measured by the feet) and in the summer it gets 90 degrees or higher.
I was thinking about clover? Your suggestions?
Thanx, |
Follow-Up Postings:
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| Tough one, jxa44. I hate to be a stick-in-the-mud, but are you sure that the Australian Natives forum is the best place to ask this question ? Italian Cypress, from my limited understanding, is more suited to a formal setting (in addition to being an exotic plant in Oz), and I'm not sure that too many of our native groundcovers fit that bill. Hopefully, one of the more experienced members can give you some info - many of the posters in this forum have mixed gardens, although I'm not sure if they have cypress per se. |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| you're right. my apologies to all. I should have written my post a little differently. My thought was that forum members may have suggestions of Austrailian (or other) ground covers in their gardens that they would recommend that could take the extremes in my climate. I mentioned the cypress allee to paint a visual picture of the look I'm trying to create. Hope this helps . . . |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| Sorry to rain on your parade as well jxa but.....There aren't that many Australians (relatively speaking) that could offer a suggestion of a plant for an area that regularly freezes in winter, the 90 (+!) degrees in summer is more what we are used to! We also measure our rainfall in millimetres and our temperatures in Celcius. I think Artie is tactfully trying to say that those drawn to aussie native plants are probably not the right people to be ask this question of. I'm not known for my tact, so I'll come right out and say it......I can't get my head around the visual picture you're trying to paint, but then I really hate cypresses, even when I try to imagine a native callitris in their stead, I can't get my head around it, though I have known people to attempt a formal garden with natives - my personal feeling is that there is some travesty taking place! Aussies are meant to roam and ramble unfettered by contrivances and formality...in short we are an unruley bunch not easily controlled (our present Prime Minister excluded) and I wish you all the best in trying to find an Aussie that will fit in with the scenario you describe. Take Care, mudlark |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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- Posted by Popi NSW Aust (My Page) on
Mon, Jan 17, 05 at 3:44
| I welcome jxa44 to our Aussie plants forum and welcome his interest in our plants. I have a combination of Aussie and exotics in my garden and they work well together..so I cant see a problem with Jxa44's request for a suitable ground cover. Something that grows in our Alpine regions would probably suit. I am sure we have regular forum meanderers who live in these colder regions. Tasmania would also have an alpine environment. All the best with your garden Jxa44! Popi |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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- Posted by pos02 NSW Aust (My Page) on
Mon, Jan 17, 05 at 15:44
| I believe many of the themedias (kangaroo grasses) will grow in alpine regions, but I doubt you could import them in the US. They are native clumping grasses, and are as tough as nails. If they won't grow there nothing will. |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| Kangaroo grasses, eh? :-) Maybe I can find seed for sale on the internet that I can purchase. Thanx so much for the suggestion -- I'll see what I can find. Do the kangaroo grasses need much irrigation? thanx again, jxa44 P.S. Thanks for your words of encouragement Popi -- great minds think alike ;-) |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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- Posted by Popi NSW Aust (My Page) on
Tue, Jan 18, 05 at 4:01
| Themeda is very hardy, grows by the roadside. Not sure how it would look with the theme you are going for though, jxa44. It does need much irrigation. I think Dichondra repens would look nice with Italian cypress, its sort of need and tidy, like the cypress. Themeda is rather gregarious! Popi |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| " the 90 (+!) degrees in summer is more what we are used to!" mudlark, 90 degrees is only about 32C, surely it gets much hotter than that in adelaide??? |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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Yes, it does trancegemini, hence the plus symbol with an exclamation mark in brackets. (!!!) I do think the average temp for summer would be low to mid thirties though.
I reckon when jxa asked what we do for grass, he/she probably meant what do you have for a lawn, and the answer would probably not be very much at home on the Aussie plants forum as they are mostly non-natives.
I can't think of a native grass that would suit the scenario described except Microleana, seed of which is hard enough to source for someone quite enthusiastic about natives, and its anyones guess as to whether it would survive the conditions described, likewise Diacondra (although the seed is more easily sourced).
Popi, I see no problem with the request either, I merely expressed that it is unlikely that it will get a suitable answer. By all means, encourage an interest in native plants, but be judicious and honest about the information and species you suggest, given the extremes of the climate. Yeah there might be someone with a knowledge of natives that comes from a somewhat similar climate but in the several years that I have come to this forum, I have yet to see their contributions. (I struggle to think of any of the areas that would freeze here in winter, reaching those summer temps as well as having bucketloads of rain.) As someone who actually has attempted a native 'lawn', I speak with some experience when I say it is MUCH easier said than done, and given the context of the request, there are more suitable choices that may require less maintainance than an Australian native lawn. I really wish the answer was different but in my experience, with a mixture of dantonia, chloris, microleana and diacondra, that has been in the ground for several years, the result barely satisfies my aesthetics, and I am one of the more enthusiastic people you will meet when it comes to native grasses. I was asked to write an article about the use of Oz natives in lawns and declined because I thought encouraging people to grow a lawn that may eventually dissappoint them would do more harm than good to the promotion of native plants in a domestic context. The situation is that most of the native species that are low enough to suit a lawn scenario are winter active and actually require considerable water in summer to stay green, possibly more water than a summer active non-native like couch. I don't water mine, because it is a ludicrous waste of a scarce resource - hence the reason it looks awful in summer, it is however gorgeous in winter and nearly redeems itself at this time of year. But given that the ground is frozen in winter where jxa lives i presumme a winter active grass would be of little use. There is a low growing form of themeda, which is summer active, but as already mentioned I doubt it would suit the situation described, if it survived the winter. In my experience all of the species except diacondra and danthonia are relatively difficult to propagate even if a seed source in the States could be identified. Sincerely, mudlark |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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oh sorry, I misread your post, I thought you said "was more than what we are used to" (I think I need glasses) ;)
you make some interesting points though, I tried d repens for a lawn substitute and it failed miserably in our summer heat, the small lawn I have planted now needs much less water than the dichondra ever did so after a couple of years of trying and hoping I gave up on it. |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| Hi All, Thank you ever so much for your suggestions. But it seems that I won't be able to find an Austrailian native grass that suits my garden afterall :-( Maybe I'll pop over to the Alpine or CA native garden forums and ask for their suggestions -- I may have better luck finding a plant that can deal my diverse micro climate there. Thanx again for all of your suggestions to help my garden grow :-) Ms. jxa44 |
RE: What do you do for grass?
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| Tramcegemini, no worries! Interesting input on the Dichondra.....thanks for correcting my spelling too...its one (of many!) I always get wrong!!! I am still trying to persist with finding a suitable 'lawn' alternative, Chloris truncata should be useful as it is summer active, but I have found it to behave more like an annual in our climate, I also found it somewhat difficult to get reliable germination with. There are times I wish I lived somewhere that has more mild summers as I think the native lawn might be more successful, it'll be interesting to hear how Greg goes with his lawn experiments in Melbourne...I know there is a large area behind the womens and childrens hospital in North Melbourne where the council is trying to establish native grasses. Here in Adelaide, Burnside Council has done a lot of great work establishing native grasses on a number of parks and reserves, but I think they are irrigating them with recycled storm water. Adelaide City Council is also doing some work on several sites in the Adelaide Parklands - focussing on regeneration of locally occuring natives rather than mass planting, which I think is a fantastic approach and will result in a diverse species mix and a natural and dynamic ecosystem - rather than a high maintainance mono-culture. cheers, mudlark |
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